BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by Quork on Wed Jul 18, 2012 12:43 am

You're sure it's 180degrees? While not knowing the loco I strongly suppose it's a little more or less (dead point^^)

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Wed Jul 18, 2012 1:01 am

Quork wrote:You're sure it's 180degrees? While not knowing the loco I strongly suppose it's a little more or less (dead point^^)
If you're going to be pedantic, then yes I suspect about 170 degrees or so, but this figure is a matter of inches and isn't documented anywhere that I can find, although I'm halfway tempted to write to one of the preserved railways with one of these Razz
(About 1 frame further around the cycle)
Not exactly sure how I'm going to handle it TBQH, a flat 180 degrees makes things so much easier to build, and would probably never be noticed.

It's a very simple example of Stephenson's valve gear really when all is said and done, much easier than some of the truly silly examples.
No-one else has attempted 3-D motion either- I know of one Italian steam loco and one German (?) diesel using working valve gear, but that's all 2D image cycling, pfft......

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by Quork on Wed Jul 18, 2012 1:20 am

Well, probably for modelling purposes 180deg will be more than enough.

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by graymac on Wed Jul 18, 2012 9:24 am

You can't see both sides at the same time, so it's immaterial anyway.
The visual impression so far is quite convincing, best of luck with that valve gear!

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by busheyheath on Wed Jul 18, 2012 10:28 pm

Please have a look at any steam engine, and you will see that it is 90 degrees! Remember, the steam engines are double-stroke machines, so a 2-cilinder engine will act like a 4-cylinder motor!

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by mrknowitall on Wed Jul 18, 2012 11:34 pm

Can i ask, on the video (which is very good by the way) i notice the first few motions are laggy, now ive got this problem with the A4, its hard because certain math cannot be implemted into the program for animated files. Have you posistioned the rod (2d or 3d) in every posistion and then done the image cycling per wheel rotation (like that of the german steam loco) or have you posistioned your rod so the far peft meets the certain area on the wheel which the rod in real life would be connected to (i apoligize for not knowing the correct names) and then get it to counter rotate at the same calculation so that it stays level while looking like its actually connected fto the wheel? Or a totally different type of code?

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Wed Jul 18, 2012 11:59 pm

Nope, it's the same basic code that was postulated on the OpenBVE forum- A 33-step animation Smile

To be exact, there will be two separate 33-step animations for this loco- One runs the main pushrods, and the second runs the slider bar. It's easier to do it this way, as there are two separate types of motion here- The main pushrod and it's connector, which moves around with the wheel in both the horizontal and vertical frames (Alright, the connecting rod's angle changes, but that's a single piece), and the slider bar, which only moves in the horizontal frame.
I did consider combining the two animations, but I can't see there'll be much difference in performance, and it's far easier to build that way Very Happy

When I've finished, I'll do a complete writeup on building valve gear, as the original writeup seems to have vanished along with the forum.
(This would have been so much simpler with 2-d images, but nowhere near as good.....)

Don't envy you Walscheart's valve gear either, at least all the complicated motion is inside the frames with this one!

Cheers

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:28 pm

Mmm, videos Cool

This shows the complete set of valve gear now working as designed. Need to go back to work on the running plate detailing next I think. Need to build the sanding gear which will hide the wheel sticking through the running plate, and the other obviously missing item is the oiling gear mounted next to the cab steps. I really need to build some stock to go with this too......
Also needs some boiler piping (No idea how I'll sort out the stuff going round the front of the smokebox, may end up doing that as a 2d transparency...), and the assorted junk placing on top of the tanks.

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by Quork on Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:49 pm

It's braking far too well. Other than that, great!

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by gyzma on Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:02 pm

It looks interesting!!! ;-)

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by Dexter on Wed Jul 25, 2012 9:32 am

Very nice, Chris. Will you share the knowledge with us once you're done?

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by mrknowitall on Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:36 pm

leezer3 wrote:Nope, it's the same basic code that was postulated on the OpenBVE forum- A 33-step animation Smile

To be exact, there will be two separate 33-step animations for this loco- One runs the main pushrods, and the second runs the slider bar. It's easier to do it this way, as there are two separate types of motion here- The main pushrod and it's connector, which moves around with the wheel in both the horizontal and vertical frames (Alright, the connecting rod's angle changes, but that's a single piece), and the slider bar, which only moves in the horizontal frame.
I did consider combining the two animations, but I can't see there'll be much difference in performance, and it's far easier to build that way Very Happy

When I've finished, I'll do a complete writeup on building valve gear, as the original writeup seems to have vanished along with the forum.
(This would have been so much simpler with 2-d images, but nowhere near as good.....)

Don't envy you Walscheart's valve gear either, at least all the complicated motion is inside the frames with this one!

Cheers

Chris Lees

http://www.bvecornwall.co.uk

Have you thought to make it a 60 step animation? To make slower speed motions alot smoother? Like that of FPS, 33 is OK but 60 is so much smoother, i've done that on the A4 rods and the slower speeds are much more smoother.

Overall so far it looks great

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:35 pm

mrknowitall wrote:Have you thought to make it a 60 step animation? To make slower speed motions alot smoother? Like that of FPS, 33 is OK but 60 is so much smoother, i've done that on the A4 rods and the slower speeds are much more smoother.

Overall so far it looks great

Not worth it at the minute IMHO. You only really notice the difference at very slow speeds (Above about 3mph or so and you can't really see it), and I think the performance hit would be out of proportion to the smoothness gained. You've got much more to benefit from with an A4, as you've got bits moving in all directions.
I'm also a little wary of adding too many animation steps, this loco will end up being enough of a killer as it is Smile

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:46 am

OK, so it's been a while since I updated this thread, things are moving slowly!
I'm still going to leave you with another teasing screenie- This time it's the rear pony truck, and some work on the chassis underside:


Observant viewers will note that this is *all* fully built in 3D, no cheating transparencies, or anything else!
(44 total faces for the pony truck!)

Could have built four or five of these with transparencies in the time it's taken me so far Razz

Cheers

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 1:03 am

So, another teaser image Very Happy

You'll note fully 3-D tank fillers, whistle apparatus, oiler, and even the piping for the small ejector. (The small brass pipe by the cab steps)

Still haven't done the front pony truck, boiler piping, bufferbeams, bunker detailing, and miscellaneous steps/ hooks attacked about the place, but looks very much like a loco now!

I'm pretty certain this is now the most complex object ever built for OpenBVE- The current total stands at just over 5,000 lines of code in the main object, with a further 19,000 odd in the animations (Alright, they're just about 600 lines of code in 32 different positions!)
When I'm finished, I'd estimate about 8,000- 10,000 lines of code plus the animations, but frankly that's being conservative Shocked

I aim for this to be a flagship OpenBVE locomotive when done!

Cheers

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by graymac on Fri Sep 07, 2012 5:41 pm

I aim for this to be a flagship OpenBVE locomotive when done!

It's got to be, Chris!! Awesome. Haven't seen anything like it before, for sure. Dare I even mention the words "frame rates"??

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 11:19 pm

graymac wrote:
I aim for this to be a flagship OpenBVE locomotive when done!

It's got to be, Chris!! Awesome. Haven't seen anything like it before, for sure. Dare I even mention the words "frame rates"??

Better than you think actually. I've only actually used about 40 transparencies out of nearly 3,000 faces on this model, most of which are in the wheels. The other big FPS killer is emissive faces, and there are only going to be 4 or so of these- No fancy headlights on this beastie Shocked
I am making heavy use of custom normals in many places though, so things may balance out a little.

When I'm done, this will implement my variant on the moving bogies for the pony trucks. I'm also hoping to do things like a puff of steam when the whistle's pulled and from the ejector when the brakes are released, but that's actually more complicated than it sounds, as that requires animation of the steam movement as well as the toggle.

Current provisional specs are:
Dual core PC
1gb RAM
128mb dedicated GFX.

Cheers

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by mrknowitall on Fri Sep 07, 2012 11:55 pm

Ahha no fancy lights?!? Nice low jib there, and a bit low even for yourself to say ive never said anthing low about yourself, Your object looks good and the coding looks good, im interested to see your take on the bogies. Im interested to see just how this pans out.

The whole puff from the valve when the whistle (horn) button is pressed is far simpler than you make out, i suppose figuring out the code button command will be the hardest part of that.

Im interested to see your end result...

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:12 am

Eh? That wasn't directed anywhere, a simple statement of fact Smile
No lights whatsoever on this other than head and tail oil lamps. You won't see those past a hundred meters or so on a dark night either......

The trouble with steam puffs is that I need to toggle an animation on when a key is pressed and then off again after three seconds or so. Toggling statics is easy, toggling a moving animation is a lot more difficult.
I haven't really investigated this avenue yet, and I haven't tried combining statefunctions and translatefunctions, so may have to rethink there. Could possibly work with some nested ifs in the translatefunction, but that'd probably be pushing it Sad

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by mrknowitall on Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:17 am

All my statics are infact more or less animated, you can include and animated inside and just put the refresh rate of three seconds at the end of a simple two image code. The only hard part will be finding that code for the horn button.

The steam puffa for the clyinders i have had fun with on the 4472, as one rod on the left is a few animations further ahead than the right, but id say include it to the animation of the whole set if you understand my point of view? Smile

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by leezer3 on Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:39 am

mrknowitall wrote:All my statics are infact more or less animated, you can include and animated inside and just put the refresh rate of three seconds at the end of a simple two image code. The only hard part will be finding that code for the horn button.

The steam puffa for the clyinders i have had fun with on the 4472, as one rod on the left is a few animations further ahead than the right, but id say include it to the animation of the whole set if you understand my point of view? Smile

Horn button is easy Wink
pluginState[i] The state of the ith plugin variable, returning an integer depending on the plugin. Is the same as atsi in the panel2.cfg.
Now using OS_ATS, you want the variable index you've set as klaxonindicator= in your OS_ATS.cfg

Haven't got as far as testing exactly how the OS_ATS delays translate into the animated file mind.
I was thinking more along the lines of a physical translation than a texture shift though.

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by mrknowitall on Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:41 am

Ino how to find and animate buttons mate Wink been doing that for a while Smile

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by mrknowitall on Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:43 am

It woulnt be a texture shift as such, depending o. What effect you are wanting, have you though of animating the brake pads against the rim of your wheels?

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by Dexter on Sat Sep 08, 2012 9:33 am

mrknowitall wrote:It woulnt be a texture shift as such, depending o. What effect you are wanting, have you though of animating the brake pads against the rim of your wheels?

Should be easy, you just create a formula based on the brake pressure... Smile

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

Post by mrknowitall on Sat Sep 08, 2012 9:41 am

Yeah relativly easy to create the code, just the drawback would be the button command as such Smile although i've got it i think with the cab handle Smile

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Re: BVE Cornwall: Current WIP

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